Why are dog breeders so stuck up? A dog can be a pet without being breed standard.?
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I asked a simple question on here earlier about an underbite. I was swamped with a bunch of horrible replies about breed standard, backyard breeders, ect. Where I live there are no poodles in the shelters, just mainly big farm dogs that breed out of control or crazy mixes like dachhound terriers.
I answered that question, and what I seen were truth-full, honest answers. You are no where near ready to breed your dog if you are considering a male with an overbite just because he’s "brown"
There may not be poodles in your shelter, but I’m sure it’s loaded with poorly bred dogs, just like the ones you’re thinking of creating.
Filed under: Dog Breeders
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With the fact that shelters are so Over run as it is why do you want to breed anything a pet should not be bred under any circumstances especially if its a dog that has not had the relevant health clearances been proven in a show ring and is being bred to better the breed
All you want to do is bring more poorly bred mutts into the world
Edit …looked at your question you asked and the answers are spot on people have no purpose even thinking of breeding if they have to ask on here and especially a dog with an under bite
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Yes, if you want a dog for a pet, it doesn’t matter what it looks like. However, when somebody shells out big bucks for a pure-bred, he expects it to conform to the standard.
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"A dog can be a pet without being breed standard."
true that. but wtf, that doesn’t mean it’s okay to BREED them o_O there’s NO reason to breed pet quality dogs when there are already so many of them rotting away in shelters…
deny it and argue all you want, but you ARE an irresponsible breeder/pet owner.
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Excuse me but YOU happen to BE a dog breeder. If you are going to bitch present the WHOLE store. Fact is you weren’t talking about a pet. YOU were talking about a potential stud for YOUR pet quality bitch.
I don’t care if there are no poodles in your shelter. Doesn’t make it ok for you to pump out subpar animals.
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=ApTNqu.RodXIj4vkiWbLtCvsy6IX;_ylv=3?qid=20101129062936AAzWqJh
And ten to one there are some decent poodle breeders near you so again no reason for YOU to be breeding.
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An underbite is a health problem, not simply a cosmetic issue. Such a dog should not be bred by anyone, even someone only seeking to breed pets.
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mb
umm.. i don’t know where you came up with the assumption that dog breeders are stuck up.
first off the majority of people on here aren’t dog breeders, simply people who know alot of dogs (training, breeds, requirements, equipment, etc.)
and second, i agree with what most people say on here. if you are looking for a dog and there are only mutts in your area i would suggest going to a rescue shelter instead of buying a mix from a breeder (and there is a shelter somewhere within resonable distance, there always is)
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Because they think they are better then everyone else. Some people believe if the dog is not perfect they don’t deserve life or a good home. But truth is every animal deserves a good home! I have a runt of a litter and a dog that was deformed when born but they are both amazing dogs!
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i do not know but not all breeders are bad back yard breeders some just love the breed
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pom mom of 2
Why don’t you learn something before you come on here ranting and sounding like a silly child.
Nobody said that a dog that doesn’t fit the breed standard can’t be a PET.
But you, my dear, were asking if you should breed your pet quality Poodle with another Poodle that has an obvious defect. So beyond the fact that YOU are an irresponsible backyard breeder, no responsible breeder would even think of breeding a dog with a defect like that.
Who cares if there are no Poodles in the shelters near you?
I don’t care if there are NO dogs in shelters - that still doesn’t give you the right to irresponsibly breed your crap dog with another crap dog producing crap puppies and flooding the breed with less than quality dogs.
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Of course a dog can be a pet if it isn’t the breed standard. That’s why show breeders sell their pet quality dogs with limited registration and a spay/neuter contract. What you are trying to do, is breed a dog with an incorrect *bite*, something that good breeders do not do. They are the ones that ARE spayed and neutered. So, what does that have to do with stuck up? Just because you want to be a BYB doesn’t mean that good breeders are stuck up. It means they are breeding correctly, unlike yourself. So, just like with your last question, make sure that you give BA to whoever the person is that agrees with you. You are here for justification of your own actions and refuse to listen to people who DO know what they’re talking about. Being a sane and educated person does not = stuck up.
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Certainly a dog can be a pet with out being a show quality dog. But that’s not what your first question asked. You asked about breeding your dog. You have to understand the answers you got where not because these people or breeders, and not because they are stuck up, it is that they are passionate about dogs.
You have to understand that millions of dogs are killed every year in shelters. Number one reason is over population. There may not be brown poodles in your shelters but how many dogs are killed in your town every year because of a lack of homes. By breeding and selling your puppies you are essentially stealing those homes from the dogs in shelters and leading to more dogs being put down. Many people find doing this to be wrong and I have to agree.
Volunteer at a shelter and watch dogs with out homes get euthanized. I
Promise you that seeing that will change your opinion on casual breeding. It is a horrible thing to witness.
A second reason people were mad is that most breeds have a standard to produce sound dogs. When someone breeds with out doing it responsibly they often produce dogs with issues. An example would be labs. Labs should be an extremely active and smart dog, very few health issues, and lean. Sadly due to over breeding and people breeding dogs with out proper genetic scores. The majoratiy of labs are big boned, dense, hyper, and have tons of joint and hip problems and skin issues. These things would be avoided if proper breeding took place. There are examples of this in all breeds.
If you are not first testing your dog and the stud to make sure they are not passing on poor genes. Then it means you are participating in the destruction of the breed you claim to love. It’s not right.
So its not that people are stuck up its they are frustrated that someone can not see the issue with breeding improperly, they feel bad for dogs as a hole.
To answer that first question if he has an underbite chances are good some of the puppies will too. In some dogs underbites can be so bad they affect qaulity of life. I would never breed a dog with that flaw.
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If they are not common in the area, maybe that’s because people don’t want them.
Your not a breeder are you? Have you studied under a breed mentor? Are you breeding to improve the breed? Are you breeding to improve genetics?
Or just to add some average poodles to the world?
If people really wanted them, they would travel to get them. Not just take one of someone down the road, that’s how things end up in shelters.
Not a professional breeder? Don’t breed.
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Even reputable AKC breeders often breed "mistakes" and sell them as only "Pet Quality." A friend of mine purchased a Rhodesian Ridgeback from an AKC breeder as a pet due to the extreme underbite the dog had resulting in her canine’s being filed all the way down so she could close her mouth properly. Turns out the breeder cannot breed two specific dogs to each other as that is the "genetic flaw" those two create when bred.
I never saw your original question but dogs with flaws aren’t always from back yard breeders they come from AKC breeders too, however, the difference being the AKC breeder will stop breeding those two dogs together to prevent it happening again, back yard breeders usually don’t.
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I answered that question, and what I seen were truth-full, honest answers. You are no where near ready to breed your dog if you are considering a male with an overbite just because he’s "brown"
There may not be poodles in your shelter, but I’m sure it’s loaded with poorly bred dogs, just like the ones you’re thinking of creating.
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I’m NOT a breeder, but someone who cleans up after bybs
It does not matter that there are no poodles in shelters near you.
That does not in any way mean you should breed PET quality dogs.
You are simply a BYB looking for a profit.
The only way ANYONE should breed, is if their dog/s are show quality, breed standard, health tested, and free of defects.
There is nothing wrong with a PET being less than breed standards, but a STUD dog or a B****, should not have any genetic defects.
By breeding a dog with a genetic defect, you give that dog’s pups the trait. Thus creating more genetically defected dogs.
It is not fair to those puppies for you to use this dog as a stud.
People may not even be interested in those puppies once they find out the father had a genetic defect, and wasn’t up to breed standards.
You have no business breeding anything.
If you must ask about choosing a stud for your dog, then you’re not a responsible breeder.
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Here’s the original question: "I have a beautiful brown female mini poodle that I have bred before, her pups come out perfect. I have been searching for a brown male stud and found one, he has a great temperment, coat, size and colour are great but he has an underbite. Should I use this male or keep looking? These brown poodles are difficult to find in our area."
My question is this - as the owner of a good female, why would you waste her on him?? A male can produce thousands of offspring in his lifetime, but a female can produce much fewer. If she really is of quality and has the health clearances to prove it, study poodle genetics and pick a high quality male whose coloration will work with hers to produce the color you desire. Breeding for a desired color is fine AS LONG AS you’re not sacrificing more important qualities to do so. I have a friend whose kennel specializes in chocolate Labradors who are dual champions (conformation and hunt tests). She’s not going to breed a top quality chocolate female to a lesser male who happens to be chocolate. Ideally she’d use a top quality stud who is a chocolate. But if one isn’t available she’ll use a top quality black male who has produced top quality chocolates before. Never sacrifice quality for color - use the best animals there are in order to produce the color.
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Why are BYBs so ignorant?
Being a PET is different than being breeding stock.
No one said that a dog with fault can’t be a pet. What they were telling you was that a dog with a fault should not be bred, even if the intended offsrping are meant to be pets.
Just because there are no poodles in your shelters (right) doesn’t mean you can use that as an excuse to breed irresponsibly.
Breeding is not just about producing a certain breed, it is about producing the healthiest examples of that breed that fit the standard. FYI - standard is more than just about looks. Certain things are undesired because they can cause problems in a breed. Proper structure (part of a standard) allows a dog to efficiently do the job they are supposed to do.
I know I am wasting my time. You care not for the breed, what it is supposed to be and the history behind it, you simply care about the money that you get by selling the pups as pets.
Good breeders arent’ stuck up, but they are passionate about their breed.
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And they can be a pet while being bred to standard. What’s your point? You want to breed your b*tch to a dog with a DEFECT, because he’s got a nice coat of the color you want. BIG FREAKING DEAL.You didn’t get a single horrible reply, just a bunch you have absolutely no interest in because they would cut into the profits for your puppy making business. The poodle world doesn’t need your contribution, because you have absolutely no interest in genetic health or proper structure. I’m sure there are good poodle breeders in your state, and plenty that will ship puppies if they’re not. Dog breeders aren’t ’stuck up’, good ones are concerned about their breed, and preserving it as it should be, and take people like you as an affront because you simultaneously destroy it in the pursuit of profit
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That doesn’t excuse you. If you can’t meet the breed standards and have your dogs genetically tested and shown to championship, then the dogs should never be bred.
What part of not meeting the standards and breeding a defect on purpose do you not understand? REPUTABLE breeders care about the dogs they breed, they want the best to the best bred for health and standards. They test their breding dogs and do not breed a defect on purpose and they show their dogs to champion to be worthy of breeding.
Otherwise, you are a backyard breeder who is only out for money.
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I’m with you on the pet thing. I have 3 dogs. 2 are mutts. I love them very much. But they are not working dogs. I have 1 full breed for working the goats. He is not a pet he is a tool I use for the farm.
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When you ask a question you might get answers you don’t like if you can’t handle it then don’t ask the question.
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Purebred dogs can be lovely pets if they do not conform to the standard……
…..if they are a bit smaller or larger than preferred
….earset is not ideal
….eye shape and set is not perfect
…skull not as smooth and clean, not as broad, lacking stop, too much stop
…tail has a kink, no kink, is a bit short
…coat is too short, not as thick
…color/markings are not as rich or somewhat mismarked
…outline of body is not as balanced
Purebred dogs that do not conform to breed standard do not make good, happy pets if…
…they are so straight in shoulder they break down and become painfully lame
…they have hip or elbow dysplasia
…they slip patellas
…they have inherited eye disease
…they bloat
…they have autoimmune disorders
…they have "exercise induced collapse"
…they have very poor temperaments
..their bite is off so much they can not eat……………..
Breeders (as opposed to puppy producers) want to protect their breed, not perpetuate faults that hinder the dogs life, and cause grief to the pet owners.
A poorly bred purebred with structure and health issues is "worse" than the "big farm dogs that breed out of control or crazy mixes like dachhound terriers".
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Ok explain how unimportant that bite is to the owner I know who had to spent thousands of $$ for orthodontic work to allow her young dog to EAT.
that is past simply breed standard and we are talking quality of life- and much more likely to happen with a parent who has a slight underbite.
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Breeders are NOT really stuck up, they just want to improve the breed, and want to advice anyone who is willing to breed to avoid using dogs that do not fit the breed standard as by not breeding to standard, can cause serious genetic disabilities, and health problems for both mother and father and pups involved, as well as cause so many serious genetic malfrmation, and many of those genetic malformation will require the poor pup to be euthanised.
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Oh yes because you can seriously make that assumption, when only 5 of the 17 people that answered your other question (which I might add you conviently left out the details of that question) are breeders. And another thing you’re a breeder, so that stuck up notion includes you.
You asked about breeding to a dog with an underbite, a genetic flaw for your breed. No good breeder would breed to such a defect. Which is why I said you have no business breeding. Chances are there are plenty of good breeders of poodle in you area. And I highly doubt there are no poodles in rescue somewhere near you. I am sure there is a breed specific one near you.
Next time add all the details, don’t make it seem like we were in the wrong when we were not so.
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I don’t give a flying crap if there are no poodles in the shelter. That still does NOT erase the fact that shelters are loaded up with BYB dogs anyways.
That doesn’t mean under any circumstances that you should be breeding pet quality dogs.
BYB’s are always making up ridiculous excuses to breed their backyard bred crap and I mean ALWAYS.
You just made one of the most common excuses of every BYB..
"Well, there aren’t any in shelters, so that gives me a reason TO breed them"..
An under-bite is a genetic flaw for your breed and obviously you would know that if you actually took the time to read the breeds standards, which odds are, you didn’t or pretty much didn’t give a flying crap, like every other BYB.
And just like every other BYB, your argument and justification for breeding, is weak and has no leg to stand on. Next !
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dog breeders are stuck up,because their infactuated with power especialy if they have a mascot that they think is rare they forget that some 1 sold them a pet @ the begginig.most people wont even sell you a dog with breeding rights even if it dont have a under bite.its a power trip were in america the land of the free & oportunity.i own 13dogs i lv them all the same 1 is a mutt the rest are champion papered try to buy a show belgium milinois see what happens they wont do it its a mafia sort of thing it almost seems like.its all a game & who cares if your a back yard breader who aint.people are rediculous these days even@ hrse races or the judges @ t friendly dog shows halt the time you dont have a chance & they havent even seen your mascot/buddy/dog.its going to change somehow i hope if they realy lv dogs
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im a A1 breeder thats why